When Jonathan Jay Pollard, an intelligence analyst for the US Navy in Maryland, pleaded guilty to espionage in 1987, he became the first American sentenced to life in prison for sharing secrets with an American ally. Throughout his incarceration, members of the Jewish community, Israeli officials and some US politicians lobbied persistently for his sentence to be reduced or commuted. After enduring seven years in solitary confinement and 23 years in what he describes as a “killing field,” Pollard was paroled in 2015. On December 30, 2020, he and his second wife, Esther, immigrated to Israel.
I met Jonathan in Jerusalem’s Waldorf Astoria café, where he recounted his gripping life story over four uninterrupted hours.
It’s an absolute pleasure to meet with you, especially in Eretz Yisrael, where you probably have many admirers but also detractors.
My father, a”h, once told me that it’s more important to be disliked by some people than liked by others. I’ve learned the truth of that in Israel. The first time someone ever spit in my face was here. I was walking by the Beit Hanasi, not far from where I used to live with my wife and kids, and there was a left-wing protest of Kaplanists who had come in from Tel Aviv. One of them came over, spit in my face and called me a chareidi fascist. I wear a kippah serugah. I don’t even own a black kippah, but we’re all the same.
I have to be very careful now because I’m armed, so my wife immediately came over to make sure I didn’t even make a move, because they usually have cameramen around. I didn’t know what to do, but my wife just looked at the person and said, “Refuah shleimah.” That totally disarmed him and he walked away. I just wiped my face and continued walking.
You’re obviously someone who isn’t afraid to take politically incorrect views.
On October 8, 2023, I took a very politically incorrect view with regard to the hostages, and my position, which hasn’t changed since then, is that we cannot allow either our external enemies like Hamas or our internal enemies like the left—most notably, the Kaplanists and anti-judicial reform crowd—to weaponize our love for each other.
What I mean by that is that we have to value the lives of seven to eight million Jews, as well as Jews worldwide, when weighed against the lives of the hostages. I was opposed to putting the rescue of the hostages on the same level as the aim of the war—demolishing Hamas and annexing Gaza. I’m sorry to say this. I empathize with some of the families, although not the ones that are being willingly used by the left, Hamas, some of our European frenemies and the Biden administration as weapons against us.
That’s why I came out publicly on October 8 saying that we have to stay focused on the ultimate objective of the war, even if that unfortunately meant sacrificing these hostages. I used the analogy I learned in the Navy of a submarine skipper whose submarine is damaged and has to close off part of the vessel—including the crew members who are there—in order to save the rest of the submarine. It’s an excruciating choice that has to be made, but we elect leaders to make these hard decisions.
Do you think that that’s because experience has hardened you, and you can now say, “I suffered for my cause, so others can do the same”?
Thank you for being the first person to ask me an appropriate question on that subject. First of all, I am now 100% disabled. They don’t even know how I’m walking. I shouldn’t be able to do that now. My back was broken.
Are you in physical pain?
I’m in horrible pain, but I don’t take any drugs for it. My lower back, my ankles and my wrists are all extremely painful.
Let me back up for a second. Very shortly after I was arrested, I was presented with a list of individuals whom the American security and intelligence professionals wanted me to implicate in my activities. I didn’t have to give any proof. I didn’t have to take a polygraph test, and I didn’t have to testify. They just wanted me to put a check mark next to their names. When I looked at the names, it was the entire hierarchy of the American Jewish establishment, and they wanted me to decapitate it. I said no.
Because?
Because I was trained never to masser on another Jew. So even if any of those people had been involved, I would have never said anything. If you want to talk about people you can go before a beit din, but not before a non-Jewish court. I knew that a lot of those people were calling for my head, but it didn’t mean anything to me. The result was that I was renditioned. A bag was put over my head. I was tied up without any clothes on and taken somewhere up in the mountains.
How long after your arrest was this?
Around four weeks. I wasn’t talking, and I never did. I could feel my ears popping, so I knew I was somewhere in a high altitude. Over the next six weeks they kept asking me to sign this document, and I didn’t know who they were. But I wouldn’t do it. After six weeks my lawyers found out where I was. By then my back was broken in four places, most of my joints were broken, and the skin had been beaten off of most of my legs. If I showed you what my legs look like you wouldn’t be able to eat. I have a plate in my skull. I was attacked and abused in a very vile way every day for six weeks. But they couldn’t get anything out of me.
I knew that even if I signed off on what they wanted they would kill me, because they couldn’t risk me saying that I’d been tortured into signing a document like that. They would have said that I had hanged myself. But I wasn’t going to give them that victory.
You knew that?
Of course. It comes along with the territory. I got them really mad. A rav once asked me what I was davening for when I was being interrogated. I replied, “I asked G-d for one of two things: Either to have them kill me quickly, or to keep my mouth shut.” Thank G-d, He kept my mouth shut.
There was one time when they were beating me very badly, and I said, “My mother hit me harder than that.” So they broke my ankles. Sometimes when I’m walking down the stairs my ankles will give way, and I’ll just tumble down. This happened around six months ago. Fortunately, my wife, Rivka, was right below me, and she caught me, at great risk to herself. That’s just what my life is like these days.
The next place I was sent to after I was sentenced was a very strange prison in the middle of the country; I still don’t even know the name of it. It looked like a house, and I thought to myself, Great! I have a house to myself. But it was actually the top of an elevator shaft. The warden met me outside and said, “Look at the sky, look at the grass and breathe the fresh air, because the next time you come out you’ll either be in a body bag or a very old man.”
I looked at him and said, “I don’t think so. G-d runs the world, not you.” It was like a bat kol. To which he replied, “We’ll see.” He was a monster of a man.
They took me down very slowly in the elevator, which was done to increase the pressure. Then I was brought to my cell, which was three meters square. There were 31 other cells, but I don’t know who was inside them. No phone, nothing to read, no visits. Nothing. Then they slammed the door.
I sat down and had the first of many conversations with Hashem, and I negotiated like Avraham Avinu. I said, “I’ve never talked to You before, but now is as good a time as any because I can’t do this on my own. You know I won’t talk, and I need the strength to survive in this coffin for the rest of my life. So here’s the deal. I will stop doing five very bad things, and I will start doing five good things according to halachah, and You will save me.”
You made an offer.
Yes. He didn’t answer me, so I had no idea whether my offer was accepted or not.
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